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 Lavry Blue with unbalanced RCA gear 
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Joined: Fri Apr 09, 2010 7:30 am
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Post Lavry Blue with unbalanced RCA gear
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...One more question: I'd like to connect my Lavry Blue's DA to a Marantz CP430 Cassette Recorder with 1/4 inch inputs, possibly via a 70s Sansui Amplifier with phono inputs. Should I use balanced XLR to 1/4 cables or a normal 1/4 cable with a XLR adaptor? Also should I do anything with the DA output settings considering the tape machine has input volume control? I can always get the Lavry to work but I'm just not sure that I'm using it at the optimal levels for each application.


Wed Apr 14, 2010 9:57 pm
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Joined: Tue Aug 08, 2006 8:29 am
Posts: 364
Post Re: Lavry Blue AD Clicks and pops problem with spdif
Quote:
One more question: I'd like to connect my Lavry Blue's DA to a Marantz CP430 Cassette Recorder with 1/4 inch inputs...


The outputs of the MDA-824 are electronically balanced (both signal pins driven by amplifiers); so you want to avoid grounding either pin. There are two ways to accomplish this:
1.) This method is recommended in cases where the unbalanced input is “normally” the device the MDA-824 is feeding. Open the top cover and set the output jumpers of the MDA-824 to “unbalanced Pin 2 Hot” configuration. This allows use of any standard XLR to RCA adapters or adapter cables.
2.) Make “special” cables that Pin 2 of the XLR to the center pin of the RCA plug, and connect Pin 1 to the outer contact of the RCA plug, with NOTHING connected to Pin 3. Using coaxial (2 conductor) cable, the “shield” is the signal “low” connection. Using shielded twisted-pair cable, you would use the “high” conductor of the twisted-pair connected to Pin 2 of the XLR and the center conductor of the RCA plug, the “low” conductor of the twisted-pair connected to Pin 1 of the XLR with the Shield, and the outer conductor of the RCA plug. The shield would NOT be connected to the RCA plug. I usually refer to this twisted-pair unbalanced wiring scheme as “quasi-balanced” because there is no signal current on the shield.

The other consideration is level. Even with the 6dB drop in level operating the output of the MDA unbalanced, you probably will need to reduce the output level using the front panel trimmers to avoid overloading the input of an RCA input (consumer level) device. The peak input level of a consumer “-10dBV” level device is typically 12-18dB’s lower than Pro gear. For example, if you have not changes the MDA-824’s calibration from the factory setting, it is set to +24dBu peak output level. Even with the 6dB loss in level operating the outputs in unbalanced mode, you would still need to reduce the level using the MDA’s front panel trimmers about 12 dB’s to achieve “-10dBV” level. The numbers don’t appear to “add up” because consumer level “0dBV =1Volt rms” and Pro level “0dBu = .775Volts rms.” The difference between “+4dBu” and “-10dBV” is very close to 12 dB’s. I would recommend looking at the “Quickstart Guides” available under the SUPPORT tab of our website for more information on calibrating the analog input and output levels of the 4496.

If you lack external meters, you can use the MAD analog-to-digital converter’s meters to change the calibration of the MDA digital–to-analog converter's output level. If you make a note of what the level is as displayed on the MAD meter before you change it, it is easy to get it back to this same level once you are finished using the MDA with the consumer level gear. For example, if you feed a "0dBFS" level 1kHz tone to the MDA-824 and plug the analog output of the MDA into the analog input of the MAD, you should see the level displayed as "0dB" on the MAD meters (assuming you have not changed the calibration from the factory setting). If you then turn the level down to "12dB" on the MAD meters using the MDA's trimmers (NOT THE MAD trimmers!), you can then switch to reference mode on the MAD and fine-tune the channel balance with the Reference mark set to "-12." When you are finished, you can use a "-12dBFS" digital signal to reverse the process and bring the MDA's output level back up to the factory setting. You need to use a "-12 dBFS" digital signal to reset the calibration so you can utilize the Reference mode of the MAD. As I recommend in the MAD Quickstart, it is easier to leave the MAD in "normal operation" mode while you get the level in the "ballpark" before switching to Reference mode, because the signal will be "off-scale" of the meters in Reference mode if it is not within a few dB's of the reference level, making it impossible to see the level change as you adjust the trimmers.

http://www.lavryengineering.com/white_p ... kstart.pdf
http://www.lavryengineering.com/white_p ... kstart.pdf

One way to avoid all of these issues is to use a simple “+4 to -10” active interface box so you can leave the MDA set up for pro-level balanced operation. Here is an example of one such interface (by company policy, Lavry Engineering, Inc. does not recommend specific brands of equipment):
http://henryengineering.com/matchbox.html

Brad Johnson
Lavry Engineering Technical Support


Thu Apr 15, 2010 9:47 am
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Joined: Fri Apr 09, 2010 7:30 am
Posts: 2
Post Re: Lavry Blue AD Clicks and pops problem with spdif
Thanks for the detailed response.

I think I'll get one of those boxes for convenience's sake. Do you think there'll be noticeable difference in audio quality if I use one of these convertor boxes instead of adjusting the MDA824's settings?

I'm the UK and these appear popular, maybe they'll do the trick for me like the Matchbox HD?

http://www.alice.co.uk/matchpac.shtml


Thu Apr 15, 2010 6:35 pm
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Joined: Tue Aug 08, 2006 8:29 am
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Post Re: Lavry Blue AD Clicks and pops problem with spdif
Quote:
I think I'll get one of those boxes for convenience's sake. Do you think there'll be noticeable difference in audio quality if I use one of these convertor boxes instead of adjusting the MDA824's settings?

I doubt that there will be a significant difference in the final product- which if I understand correctly is an audio cassette. There is some (small) loss in turning the level of the MDA-824 down significantly, and depending on how long the cables would be, there could also be some loss in running the signal quality through long unbalanced cables. Using this type of "pro to consumer" interface would ease the requirements on the cables by allowing balanced high level signals to make the long run and the use of short RCA cables to make the connection to the receiver/deck.

Quote:
I'm the UK and these appear popular, maybe they'll do the trick for me like the Matchbox HD?
This unit appears to be of equal functionality and quality to the Henry Engineering one; and it does accept full +24dBu on its inputs. That means the LavryBlue MDA-824 could be kept at the factory calibrated level of +24dBu for full-scale digital level signals. I must qualify my answer, because I can't say I have had direct experience with this unit.

Brad Johnson
Lavry Engineering Technical Support


Fri Apr 16, 2010 1:00 pm
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